Creating Thriving Workplaces for Better Performance | Workspace Design Lab Ep.7

What’s the real reason your office isn’t working? It might not be the space, it might be the strategy.

In this episode of Workspace Design Lab, host Syl Vander Park is joined by Kati Barklund, Senior Manager of Workplace Strategy and Global Chair of Workplace Evolutionaries. Kati unpacks what truly makes a workplace “work” and why the future of office design goes far beyond furniture.

From cultural alignment to data-driven design, this conversation offers rare insight into how leaders can reshape their environments to support performance, purpose, and wellbeing.

If you're an architect, interior designer, or workplace leader ready to go beyond the basics, this episode is packed with wisdom from one of the industry’s most experienced voices.

Key Takeaways

• Strategy starts with understanding the organization’s pain points
• Culture and collaboration often drive workplace transformation
• Data-driven needs assessments are essential
• Physical workspaces must align with organizational goals
• Experience and performance are deeply connected
• Remote work proved employees can be trusted
• Ergonomics and flexibility are key to employee wellbeing
• Asynchronous work can reduce meeting fatigue
• Change management is often the missing link in office redesign
• Being connected to oneself is foundational to workplace fulfillment

Best Moments

00:04:15. “The only reason we have a workplace is for the people and for them to be able to perform at their best.”
00:06:21. “An office culture died a little bit with COVID.”
00:07:44. “We as employees showed in many ways that we were to be trusted.”
00:11:13. “We must be much more like stop to reflect on our meeting cultures.”
00:13:36. “We don't want to be going to work just to collect a paycheck.”
00:15:14. “We can never be too young to be connected with ourselves.”
00:20:00. “We are quite used to things and a little bit lazy and comfortable.”
00:23:56. “I do all of this for people to really make people thrive.”

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Workspace Design Lab | Healthy Spaces, Lasting Impact

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Join host Syl VanderPark as we explore ergonomic office design, modern interiors, and sustainable workspace solutions with architects, designers, and industry leaders.

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Transcript

0:00

Going deeper in our self and also what's important and meaningful for us. It doesn't always have to be like that. We are changing the world. It can also just being that I can see that what I do creates value and how it fits in the bigger picture and how others see that. What I do is of value. Welcome to Workspace Design Lab, the show where architects, interior designers and workplace leaders explore the future of workspace interiors. Each week we dove into ergonomic office design, modern workspace trends and sustainable furniture solutions that improve wellbeing and performance. I I'm Silvana Vander PARC and together will uncover the stories, strategies and innovations that help you design offices that truly work. Let's dove in. How do you approach workplace strategy? So yeah so I'm a big I know big right strategies and change manager for me like work strategy is always starting from the client and the needs. When does a person approach you? When do they come to you? And then how do you step through a project with them? So it could be of course, that there is a lease agreement that is ending or that the workplace is not anymore fitted for the needs. Or maybe it's that it's hard to get people, get the employees to want to come to the office or maybe and there's there's also a lot of times we really don't get the collaboration, the communication, the kind of culture we want to have in the office or at the workplace. So it can be different kinds of pains that the organization has and wants to see. The workplace could actually help with that. And what we always do is to start we analyze thing as is through different kind of ways and trying to make it as data based as possible. Interviewing the leadership team in Australia face. Most often I work towards a leadership team, so really understanding how the workplace can support that organization and business strategically for what the organization is aiming for and what's working, what's not working to do that. We're very surgical level, but then of course quite often having a survey to get input from employees and not always asking exactly what do you want them or looking at the needs and behaviors and tasks and what's working well and not working well and how does the collaboration look like and so on. Of course, looking at the current premises and locations, workplaces and with our experience seeing what could be potential or developed further quite often also some kind of utilization studies, how are we actually using the space? And all of this gives us a very good understanding of, okay, this is how it's working today. And that process in the pre study needs analysis, we quite often see the potential, but we also look very much in the dialog with the leadership team. Where is the maturity, are they also maybe other changes that are going on? So what could be possible right now? So maybe we cannot reach always to the potential that is out there for that organization, but maybe we need to take this first step and then start building from that starting the journey. It's really looking at the performance. People are saying, I want my company to perform better. There's something that's holding us back. Yeah, it's the experience and the performance. I'd say that it's also intertwined together. So when the experience and toolbox is better for the employees, so when they are engaged and empower, then of course the performance of the organization. The only reason we have a workplace is for the people and for them to be able to perform at their best and do a really good job. So that's of course about the output. But then workplace also needs to be, well, cost efficient and sustainable, secure those other aspects as well and attractive. And I imagine too it's a lot about organizing all the elements that goes into running a business to help people, you know, address. Okay is is that part looked after? Because I'm just thinking even just as I look to grow my office here in Virginia, you know, I think, okay, identifying what the biggest pain points are and then gradually attacking them and a lot of it can come down to organization. You know, maybe you are growing or you are changing or yeah, you need to start a new office or maybe you need to change or develop your culture leadership way of working. So that's also something that many times today. It's just getting people together, getting that pulse vibrancy at the office, that communication, the collaboration coming together at working together. I started working in year 2000, you know, when I graduated. So that's 25 years now. So yeah, maybe we're around the same time. But then I also worked ten years before that in be a similar area with not workplace experience but more from a restaurants conference even kind of thing. But it's the same kind of logic, right? You're going to have things like, listen, in Canada and the U.S., there was a bit of an economic issue in the year 2000. Stayed and the Sweden and the Nordic. Yeah, there was a hit there. And then of course, 2008, you know, that was the big change. And then probably then it was like COVID. So then trying to, you know, you've got the generation that's growing up kind of online and now trying to get them back into introduced, integrating them into the workforce. Now like an office culture died a little bit with COVID, people started to work from home and they said, okay, we're hiring somebody new, but training them remotely isn't the same as being physically all together. They don't learn the culture of a company and to really be a part of it, like how it was pre-COVID, you come in and you learn either this is for me or this isn't for me. That's what it is. That's the culture. So what are you seeing right now as kind of the changes? Like what change management are you dealing with? The most, I think is you touch in quite a many things there because like before what happened during COVID. And I think that in many ways everything that has happened since COVID, it was just accelerating during COVID. So we were always going in the same direction thanks to digitalization and other things as well. But then they happened almost over or a nights that we had to adjust things and learn new things. And one of the very important things that we did changed during COVID was also the trust. So we as an employees, we showed in many ways that we were to be trusted. So we did manage, most of us, our work in a very good way, sometimes even better doing that from home or other location and the office or normal physical workplace. So that's also then been really hard going back, especially if you try to have a policy or something and through that try to get people back instead of focusing on what we are going to do together, why we should be at the office and how it can help us to achieve our targets and mission. And you also pointed out culture aspect. So of course we can develop great culture. Thank you. Totally. Of course, it is also quite often easier to do it physical, especially if you're getting new people to the workplace, younger people and so on. It's quite often easier to do that introduction and getting people into the culture when they can do it physically. We we're just talking about more of a need to find balance, you know, that there's, you know, the digital world allows us to be more flexible about when we work and taking breaks when you need them. And you know, I was talking about ergonomics with an ergonomics. They said, you know, for kids, after 30 minutes of learning, they need to get up and run around. And so we have that, too, where we need to engage our bodies. And always being at the desk is, you know, can take away from that physical comfort of being able to move around. That's where, you know, the height adjustable desks come in and kind of trying to make the desks a little bit more ergonomically satisfying for a person working there. And also accessible, flexible activity based offices getting the moment and not just because it's good for us to to move very, but also because with them meet more people and interact. I do remember one thing about COVID was that you could line up meetings. You know what I mean? The virtual meetings. So it was like meeting after meeting after meeting after meeting. Yes. And still have them, unfortunately. Yeah. Meetings. That's one of the main problems today that we have all these meetings that are really not that productive. We must be much more like stop to reflect on a meeting cultures and what to attend or not and to really have agendas. We are quite digital and I think that that we think that we are more than we actually are. Because what is important to find is that we don't have to have everything synchronous, so we don't have to have all this meetings. We can find ways to to work together, collaborate together without having a meeting when it suits you best so we can bring in documents or work together. And it could be different time zones, but we don't have initial meetings for everything. I think I want to work with you because this is so interesting. You must have so many different options that you can implement. There's a lot of different ways now to run a business now. And of course, even well before COVID, we have had these organizations in different locations in the world or also fully remote businesses. So it's been possible. And of course there's no right or wrong. It's just trying to find out what fits your organization and where you are in the journey right now. What do you need so that you can perform and do the things you need to and want? Yeah, I always look to how we can raise our children for future work. I mean, it's very hard to you can't possibly think about, okay, what's going to happen in the next ten years. I don't know if you do see trends that are happening or if you can kind of look into the future and say, Oh, this is an emerging workplace scenario, that's going to be a reality. I mean, people are talking about AI, but we're not really sure what AI how that's going to really impact us, because you've also got world events that you can't see coming that will impact what our world will look like, what our economy will look like. I thought, okay, you help workers to or workplaces to help workers enjoy a sense of purpose, autonomy, mastery and connectivity. But, you know, when we're looking at kids in school, I always look at this, you know, at what age, how young can we be thinking about how we work, you know, and finding that balance? I think sometimes it's here in this part of the world, it's like, you know, schools are colleges are more vocational. Like you go to college, a community college to study like something like accounting or something like that, whereas universities are kind of more your ivory tower, you know, thinking bigger concepts, but it's not necessarily super practical, you know, is there a practicality that can be taught, you know, how young can you can you teach that, you know, like about pursuing your purpose and learning how to achieve balance and be sustainable and, you know, kind of look at life in sustainable terms rather than saying, okay, I'm just going to let myself burn out because, you know, I know people they've been in one industry, like, for example, the animation industry. You know, my brother had started in it, he was doing 3D animation and he got burnt out. I just said, okay, that's it, I have to change now. But that industry changed also just because of the business model of it, but avoiding burn out, because I think that's mainly what we need to accomplish, right? We don't want to be going to work just to collect a paycheck, you know, and just kind of mustering through our day. We want to tap into what's in our souls. I think it's a really good question and discussion and many of the principles that I have when working with workplace strategy, you can apply them not just in workplaces. You can in your own work life, personal life in many situations also. And I think one of the basis ones that we are talking about here is also like that we need to be connected with ourselves, first of all, so we can never be too young to be connected with ourselves and actually, when being very small kids, we are very connected with ourselves. Then we lose a lot of but that in school and all the social contacts and all the things that we should do and how we should be and so on, but being connected to ourselves, also being connected to others around us, really important. And that's the basics. If we are not connecting to ourselves and to others, we cannot work with direction or change or doing things. So we need to be connected. Yeah. So more than balance, it's part of it. But the connectivity, who am I? What is important to me and also aligning hopefully what is important to me and what is meaningful to me and being able to develop and also have fun to be able to align that also with my work or if I'm in school or so I looked at, you know, kind of culturally what is the area kind of thing and the happy people and kind of more progressive of education system and focus on equality. And I don't think probably Swedish and Finnish schools would necessarily come to you because they're already, you know, you're a product of them. So, you know, you've got these ideas. I would think that you're a product of them in terms of being connected to yourself. But I'm just wondering if any schools or universal GIs would say, Hey, how do we get our students kind of focused on fulfilling their purpose in life? You know, it's not just about, okay, you've got to read and write and meet all of these kind of global standards and state standards, etc., etc.. But, you know, you've got that, you know, I remember being in school and people talking about the true North, what's your true north, you know, and talking more about that, but finding ways to implement that like more so in, say, Daly teaching or something like that. What was the schooling like for you growing up? Was it very inspirational or was it kind of more of the didactic? I think like being Hungarian was very inspirational. I grew up in this very small village up north by the polar circle with a lot of freedom. Yeah. Then I started in Stockholm, the capital of Sweden. In my work life. I started work very young when I was 13. I got a lot of trust from very early age. I already had a managerial role when I was 1516, I got freedom to explore a lot of things. I'm very fortunate. It's been a great school. I had really good leaders and people around me, very lucky in my organization. Now mindfulness is part of our way of working. We starts most of our meetings with some kind of a mindfulness exercise or breathing exercise, or just connecting with our selves with each other. And that also makes our meetings much more efficient because we can be present in there. Most of the time we are physically there or like digitally showing up in the meetings, but we are not really there. So there is so much more we can do, but also going deeper in ourselves and also what's important and meaningful for us and hopefully we can align that with our work in some way at least so that it feels meaningful. It doesn't always have to be like that. We are changing the world. It can also just be that I can see that what I do creates value and how it fits in the bigger picture and how others see that. What I do is of value, so I can also do that kind of things. Yeah, I really like that a lot. What was the first time when you saw Change come that were you implemented or you helped a company to navigate through a change, a pain point? And it came back and it just demonstrated that your theory or your strategy worked. I think this is very interesting because at university I did business studies, also social psychology, cultural anthropology, both my bachelor and masters work. It was about change management. I had no idea I was going to work with that later, but so I wasn't somehow interested in that and also did a lot of research well because quite often the hardest thing is to create change and do change. When you don't see that it's like an immediate threat or you really need to do it, you might understand that you're needed, but then we are quite used to thing and a little bit lazy and comfortable. Oh yeah, we'll do it tomorrow or maybe next week or next year or something like that, and then it might be too late. So it's also just how we start to do it. And also when it comes to change, it is so hard to to even for us as individuals to do even the easiest change that we know. It's good for us to exercise and eat healthy food. And still it is so hard to get that into a habit and doing it all the time. And then when we have a change in the workplace, it might be quite often we understand and it seems to be very simple, but for us to then change our behavior, stop doing something and start doing something new and just as individuals, but then doing that at a collective level because that's what it's about in the context of a workplace that we all need to then change our behavior to the new ways of working. And most of the time we don't put enough change management support in that work. And so a lot of times we don't get the effects. We could have the best physical adjusted workplace is best technology, everything. But still we don't get the effects that we want to because we are not able to change our leadership and culture way of working. Working change the behavior. That's fascinating right there because, you know, it's even like say so if we put desks and that our height adjustable and you've got different zones that go up and down so you can get maximum you know, ergonomic adjustment, physical articulation. But, you know, a lot of times people are still sitting at their desks, you know, so you do need to remind them or something. And sometimes there's timers. I know my Apple Watch tells me, okay, time to get up. And sometimes I listen to it and sometimes I don't. So yeah, how can you then help with that? I know that in some cases you can, for example, make sure that you raise up the tables and maybe the cleaners help you to do that. So when you're coming into the morning, all the tables are up. Yes. And I like your idea of having you don't need to have synchronous meetings. You can have something maybe that's recorded for later on or something like that. So maybe it's a pop up. That's a video saying, hey, did you know that you can do this with your desk or something? You know, and I like that term change management support to help things transition over down the road to help people as intended as your family business oriented or you started working at 13. I'm the only one who has ever studied in the university level in my family, so the first one. But everyone is hardworking that they have no clue what I'm doing. But you've married the two because you're hard working. You saw the examples of hard working, of hard work, did it from the bottom. So that's also helped me a lot when working with organizations and leaders, employees, because in most of the cases I've done it myself from the bottom up and now advising and helping job. I have the understanding and I've also always been very fortunate and worked with very different kinds of organizations and industries, both in the private and public sectors. So and I love the variation and just digging into all those organizations and how can I help them to perform better? That's lovely. Are you able to kind of articulate what long term impact you want your work to have? I mean, it's helping companies move through change and workers find fulfillment and companies achieving, you know, what their vision is and all that. Not to say that that's not enough. It is. But is there something in the back of your mind, something, you know, that you say, I'd love to do this? You know, yeah, I do all of this for people to really, like, make people thrive, like realizing the potential of people and then I know that we can also realize the potential of organizations and create a lot of value for society and our planet and next generations. I love people. That's why I do it. And I see there is so much potential, untapped potential and just try to help with that journey. Yeah. And help everybody to gel. And yes, there is so much more that all of us can contribute to. And yeah, you're a good cheerleader. I can see it. I can see it. Yeah. So for people to to work with you, what's the best way for people to reach out to you? Is there a better channel to reach you? Well, reaching out to me through LinkedIn or so and and mostly based in Sweden, but I also have my. Yeah. Most far away client in Australia since seven or eight years back. And last year I was over half year in Saudi Arabia helping a bank group there and working a lot with the US and other parts of the of the world. So it's, it's lovely. It's interesting that you mentioned Saudi Arabia because I remember we have projects in Saudi Arabia and they said, Silvana, are you coming? And at that time I said, Well, I think it was like I could only enter the country, escorted by a male. But that was a long time ago. That's a long time ago. So it's not like that anymore. So things have eased that way. I was going to say, how is it as a woman going over and working in these environments? It was pretty much exactly the same as in Sweden. It felt very appreciated because they precisely, like us, want to create great workplaces for their employees so that they can thrive and they don't always have the knowledge that we have yet. So coming from more from an engineer perspective, trying then to understand the needs of the people and translating that to the facilities, to the workplaces, to the services. So very eager to learn. And they also want to learn from the best because they want to do it in the best way. Oh, that's wonderful to hear such a wonderful experience. And I also felt that I could really bring value and make a difference. So it's very open minded. Then I felt it and it's like, Yeah, a lot of appreciation. And they tried to do exactly what we tried to do everywhere to make it wonderful. Thrive, yeah. What's your favorite project or what's your favorite story? You know, working with clients, I have many clients that I've been working with so many years and they become of course, it's professional, but they also become friends. So that sounds so lovely. And I enjoy helping them, being able to be to service. So I think that's really nice when you have that trust and also have that sustainable relationship and can help not just through a project but also ongoing, whatever the media is. Yeah, yeah. Because yours is, you know, you're there on hand whenever something new comes up or you can, you know, you're kind of like a doctor, you know. And some of our clients, I'm a bit of a doctor and of course there might be some bigger projects or things that need to be done. But I'm always there. And yes, I can tell right now, you you were talking about do you have a speaking engagement next week in Dubai? In Dubai. And then people want to catch up with you. I know you do. You know you're active with if mar the facility managers if mind workplace revolutionaries what first community or if I'm the global chair of that. So that's also a really good source if you're interested in in the topic of workplace too just received it's yeah so we talk and then you will find me and a lot of my passionate workplace colleagues. Yeah, that's wonderful. It's been so nice to talk with you and get to know you more and what you do and talk about the workplace design and what it means to you. I love it when we can tap in and I can see you get excited, you know, about what you do. Was there anything else that you would want to add or say, know if there is something that someone wants to talk to me or talk with me, just reach out. We can have a dish or a coffee. There you go. Yeah. The world is today very small. It's just a second away when we have all the digital tools. It is. I guess I'm still I'm probably still adjusting to it, but, you know, it makes it more fun, that's for sure. If people are open to it and it doesn't feel so odd that you can meet people, it doesn't, you know, 5 minutes here or 10 minutes there. It doesn't have to be such a big deal. Yeah, it's so wonderful because there are people that you connect with probably, I don't know, so family everywhere in the world. And now you have the possibility through all the digital tools, you don't have to travel around physically, but you can also just meet people virtually and have connected conversations or collaborate on things or share things, learn together. It's wonderful. And then when you get to see people in person, then it's fireworks, right? That also happens quite often when I'm in the studio somewhere in the world is so. So to just let them know that, okay, I'm here and can we have a Yeah. Of physical coffee old fashioned. And that happens to me all the time. And I meet people in the trains or flights or when I'm in cities also this week in Gothenburg. Oh, nice. Berg. And we just had a work dinner. The world is small today. It is. I'm starting to learn we're all connected. Yeah. All we have to do is kind of open up to it. Like, you know, I love doing these talks with people and talking about what I do at work and what they do at work. That's exciting to me. So I'll be floating for the rest of the day, kind of, you know, because we had this conversation, we connected and yeah, that adds value to my life to connect people, just as you say. Yeah, yes. Important topics. Yeah. So you are also creating a lot of value. Yeah. From it. Thanks for checking out Workspace Design Lab. If you're an architect, interior designer or workplace professional looking to stay ahead in ergonomic office design and modern workspace interiors, make sure to follow the show on your favorite podcast platform for more resources on sustainable office furniture and human centered workspace design, visit us at Novel Income until next time.